Galian's weekly Update Post

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GalianRyu
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Galian's weekly Update Post

Post by GalianRyu » Sat Jul 30, 2016 9:39 pm

Hey guys,

Sorry to have left you in the dark, I've been just trying to work as hard as I can. I figured what I will do is, I'll set this thread up, and I'll give you guys an update every Saturday just so you don't worry that nothing is happening. Note that I'm still not really reading the forums (because, man, it's so easy to get swept down rabbit trails doing that), but I want to give you guys something tangible. I can't lock threads (since I'm not actually a forum admin), but know that I probably won't be reading this thread until Saturday rolls around again lol.

On to the meat of the matter: I am still chugging away at code, but we've hit the hairy part of it where I can't cleanly just work on one thing because everything starts being dependent on everything else like a massive coded spiderweb. I've got villagers and they can talk and move around (I managed to hybridize Millenaire's path-finding system with the vanilla one in 1.8 which is actually really strong, so I'm super proud about that). I have the beginnings of the village infrastructure started and have implemented the code that holds building designs and sets construction.

Currently I am getting GUIs set up (the windows that open when you talk to villagers and such), but I've been working through a tangle because they aren't working the way I want them to. I finally broke down and asked for help from the Forge Gurus so hopefully someone can help me get it going. Unfortunately, I also suffered major burn out this last week. Sleep has been elusive, my job decided to do a disaster recovery test (which became an actual disaster), and I ran out of episodes of Mythbusters to watch while coding lol. It became a struggle to even get up and turn on the computer, much less code.

So while I discuss Gui-ing with the people who know this stuff way better than me, I'm giving myself a small vacation and trying to beat Rise of the Tomb Raider. One I have Guis set up, the rest of it should (should...SHOULD, please be) straight forward.

See you all next week!

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Zoythrus
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Re: Galian's weekly Update Post

Post by Zoythrus » Sun Jul 31, 2016 2:57 am

Thank you for the update, Galian!

We're all eagerly waiting to see what you have in store for Millenaire, but don't let our expectations overwhelm you. Take as much time as you need - we're gonna be fine. :D

Orange1861
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Re: Galian's weekly Update Post

Post by Orange1861 » Sun Jul 31, 2016 9:04 am

It's okay burn-outs happen to almost all of us.
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RogerT554
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Re: Galian's weekly Update Post

Post by RogerT554 » Sun Jul 31, 2016 2:12 pm

Hi Galian,

Many Many thanks for the update.
As another member has said any news is brilliant and keeps us from worrying that Millenaire has been dropped.

I'm sure we all appreciate the work that re-coding a Mod like this is, and please take your time so you don't
get too fed up and burn out.

Thanks again.

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trollkind
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Re: Galian's weekly Update Post

Post by trollkind » Sat Aug 06, 2016 2:39 pm

Where to begin ... I'd love to take you out for a night of good food and drinks! Helps me when work and life gets me down. Alas, I have no idea where Ry'le is. But if you ever visit hamburg, germany, I owe you one.
I greatly appreciate the update but don't let that pressure you into feeling like you have to deliver great news every week. If there's no progress that's fine too. This isn't your job and the one you have sounds stressfull enough. We're in it for the long haul, better to wait than have you burn out completely.

I wish this mod had more publicity and support, not just a bunch of us. It's the thing that gives purpose to Minecraft beyond arbitrary challenges and multiplayer.
Maybe if 1999 more people would throw a dollar your way on patreon instead of just me. :p

Since you seem to work on conversation and questing right now, have you taken a look at the Better Questing mod? Maybe that's something to either become compatible with or get inspired by.
http://www.minecraftforum.net/forums/ma ... esting-mod

I hope you had a better week and looking forward to hear from you again,
Simon aka trollkind

PsiGuy60
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Re: Galian's weekly Update Post

Post by PsiGuy60 » Thu Aug 11, 2016 8:44 pm

GalianRyu, may I just once again state how much I admire you for taking on this project.

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felinoel
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Re: Galian's weekly Update Post

Post by felinoel » Sat Aug 13, 2016 11:46 pm

GalianRyu wrote:Sorry to have left you in the dark, I've been just trying to work as hard as I can. I figured what I will do is, I'll set this thread up, and I'll give you guys an update every Saturday just so you don't worry that nothing is happening.
I don't see this as needed, I would rather be updated when you feel something needs to be mentioned because a weekly thing could be too much of a chore and waste of your time.
trollkind wrote:I wish this mod had more publicity and support, not just a bunch of us. It's the thing that gives purpose to Minecraft beyond arbitrary challenges and multiplayer.
That was actually why I tried getting a dwarven culture, years ago Millenaire got TONS and TONS of fans thanks to the Yogscast who enjoyed the mod and told all of their fans about it, if we could get them to play the mod again on their channel...

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GalianRyu
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Re: Galian's weekly Update Post

Post by GalianRyu » Mon Aug 15, 2016 4:27 am

trollkind wrote:Where to begin ... I'd love to take you out for a night of good food and drinks! Helps me when work and life gets me down. Alas, I have no idea where Ry'leh is. But if you ever visit hamburg, germany, I owe you one.
Ry'leh is the city of the Ancient Ones, you have to go complete insane before you can even see it ;) Explains why I've been here so long.

Though in all seriousness, I hope I can visit Hamburg one day. I would love to go to Europe again.
felinoel wrote:
trollkind wrote:I wish this mod had more publicity and support, not just a bunch of us. It's the thing that gives purpose to Minecraft beyond arbitrary challenges and multiplayer.
That was actually why I tried getting a dwarven culture, years ago Millenaire got TONS and TONS of fans thanks to the Yogscast who enjoyed the mod and told all of their fans about it, if we could get them to play the mod again on their channel...
Maybe we can talk them into doing so when we have the new version!

Thank you all for the supportive messages! Seriously, you guys are absolutely amazing and that's why I can keep working on this, even as each new obstacle raises it's head. I have felt like you guys might give up on me, so I'm glad to see everyone is still excited. I will keep going, and thank you all!

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Zoythrus
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Re: Galian's weekly Update Post

Post by Zoythrus » Mon Aug 15, 2016 5:01 am

GalianRyu wrote: Thank you all for the supportive messages! Seriously, you guys are absolutely amazing and that's why I can keep working on this, even as each new obstacle raises it's head. I have felt like you guys might give up on me, so I'm glad to see everyone is still excited. I will keep going, and thank you all!
This group may be small, but we're loyal and hardy, and able to overcome all obstacles that beset our favorite mod.

Don't worry about us, we're going to support you the whole way, Galian. :D

MoonCutter2B
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Re: Galian's weekly Update Post

Post by MoonCutter2B » Mon Aug 15, 2016 3:01 pm

I appreciate all the effort you put into this project.
And I can report that this "small group" is probably a lot larger than what can be seen in this forum.
It looks like there are a constant stream of new millenaire players if all the messages in minecraft forum is any indication.

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felinoel
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Re: Galian's weekly Update Post

Post by felinoel » Tue Aug 16, 2016 5:25 am

MoonCutter2B wrote:I appreciate all the effort you put into this project.
And I can report that this "small group" is probably a lot larger than what can be seen in this forum.
It looks like there are a constant stream of new millenaire players if all the messages in minecraft forum is any indication.
Indeed, I know a few popular Millenaire youtubers who are just waiting for the new release like TechGremlin and CalmDownLevelUp.

Orange1861
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Re: Galian's weekly Update Post

Post by Orange1861 » Tue Aug 16, 2016 10:06 am

Plus this will help the Minecraft community move away 1.7.10. :D
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Samsonyt
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Re: Galian's weekly Update Post

Post by Samsonyt » Wed Aug 17, 2016 4:50 am

It is fantastic to see/hear the project is being kept up with. Much appreciation for Galian.

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GalianRyu
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Re: Galian's weekly Update Post

Post by GalianRyu » Mon Oct 10, 2016 11:24 pm

Hey guys,

I have been absolutely swamped, haven't even been home a good portion of the previous couple weeks, but I've been working when I can.

Figured I'd show guys one of the things I've been working on, by popular demand (or at least Ticlon's demand):
Image

Yep, Byzantine Tile Stairs. Took ages to get it to work right, and was only possible by kinda hacking the new Forge blockstate system, but I figured that they should have the stone brick in them so that buildings using them will also look like the buildings using the Stone Tile blocks.

I've also been kind of revisiting and redoing the Hindi buildings, making them more modern (as in Minecraft blocks and styles, I actually looked up ancient Indian architecture for inspiration). When I have some good screenshots, I'll post them up and see what you guys think.

Alright, well I haven't slept much this week, so I'm going to pass out for a bit, but just wanted you guys to see what's happening.

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Zoythrus
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Re: Galian's weekly Update Post

Post by Zoythrus » Tue Oct 11, 2016 12:48 am

GalianRyu wrote:Hey guys,

I have been absolutely swamped, haven't even been home a good portion of the previous couple weeks, but I've been working when I can.

Figured I'd show guys one of the things I've been working on, by popular demand (or at least Ticlon's demand):
Image

Yep, Byzantine Tile Stairs. Took ages to get it to work right, and was only possible by kinda hacking the new Forge blockstate system, but I figured that they should have the stone brick in them so that buildings using them will also look like the buildings using the Stone Tile blocks.

I've also been kind of revisiting and redoing the Hindi buildings, making them more modern (as in Minecraft blocks and styles, I actually looked up ancient Indian architecture for inspiration). When I have some good screenshots, I'll post them up and see what you guys think.

Alright, well I haven't slept much this week, so I'm going to pass out for a bit, but just wanted you guys to see what's happening.
Thank you for the update, Galian! You know, we'd be more than happy to help redesign stuff. We want to take as much of the work off of you as possible. :)

ThaneAngus
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Re: Galian's weekly Update Post

Post by ThaneAngus » Tue Oct 11, 2016 2:21 am

Thank you for the update, Galian! You know, we'd be more than happy to help redesign stuff. We want to take as much of the work off of you as possible. :)
I agree, and I'm also very excited to see these new Hindu buildings you had planned, Galian. Keep those screenshots rolling!
"Now does he feel
His secret murders sticking on his hands...
Those he commands move only in command,
Nothing in love. Now does he feel his title
Hang loose about him, like a giant’s robe
Upon a dwarfish thief."

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Re: Galian's weekly Update Post

Post by felinoel » Tue Oct 11, 2016 3:45 pm

Zoythrus wrote:You know, we'd be more than happy to help redesign stuff. We want to take as much of the work off of you as possible. :)
What he said.

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Re: Galian's weekly Update Post

Post by Zoythrus » Fri Oct 21, 2016 5:11 pm

I just spent around 5 hours chatting with Galian about the state and progress of Millenaire, and I have plenty to update you on!

He says that he's approximately 50% done! This project might have been a little more than he was expecting, but slowly he's chugging through it. He says that he's very thankful that we're behaving ourselves, despite his seldom appearances. :)

A ton of the AI pathfinding has been reworked, and it's going to be a mesh of the original pathfinding and what 1.8 provides. This should help the Millagers out greatly, and they might get stuck a whole lot less. With a slight rework of how the Millagers think, it should be much easier to add quests, contextual dialogue, and other things.

Due to problems with the png system, Galian is changing how buildings get stored. Here, he has decided to hardcode everything, and cut the png system out entirely. I've decided to take up this monumental task so that Galian doesn't have to worry about it. He assured me, though, that custom buildings will be readded eventually, but some things are going to have to be stripped away for the time being for the sake of stability and speed.

Eventually, Galian is going to rework how trading and merchants work. They'll mainly stay the same, but with a few changes that prevent massive surpluses of resources accumulating in the chests of the villages. Merchants should also become smarter and look for specific items that their village is lacking, instead of just taking and depositing random materials. He's also discussed the idea of "Trade goods" that each culture produces, things like obsidian shards and silk. If reputation is high enough between villages, you can expect to see the various Millagers wearing another culture's jewlery/clothing to symbolize both high relations and an "interest" in a foreign culture. This all might come in a later patch, but he finds it rather important.

Village Stones are now going to be the center of a village, as they're going to be used to keep everything straight in memory. They'll keep track of Millager locations/jobs, building locations, raids, etc, in an attempt to keep everything streamlined. Whether they'll project an aura for the village has yet to be decided, but that might come later if it does.

Millenaire's commands, like M, V, and G, have been removed in favor of a more "Minecraft" feel. Galian says that he wants to remove those key commands and replace them with a book that works as the tutorial, and keeps track of various Millenaire stuff. A bunch of admin commands are also being added, for better server play. This is all to preserve Minecraft's "exploration" focus.

We tossed around the idea of having some villages spawn with a few upgrades, to imply that they've been here a little while, while others might not even have been built, yet. He mentioned that he likes the idea of a bunch of Millagers spawning, clearing out the area, and building the town hall and a few buildings right before your eyes!

He has reorganized how the mod and the assets are structured, so now we can have a much easier time of getting resource packs made for Millenaire! Woo! :D

Contextual dialogue is confirmed as an eventual addition. So, Millagers will talk about not having enough food, what they think of cultures they know about, and other sorts of things. This should both provide players a bit of immersion as well as a way to give them some sort of direction in village development.

All in all, he's doing his best with what little time he has, and I know that Millenaire is going to be better than ever when he's done!

Ruff Ghanor
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Re: Galian's weekly Update Post

Post by Ruff Ghanor » Fri Oct 21, 2016 8:35 pm

BEST NEWS EVER!

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Re: Galian's weekly Update Post

Post by Ruff Ghanor » Fri Oct 21, 2016 8:41 pm

now in a more serious tone:
Very excited for the update, haven't played Minecraft for a loooooong time but this might just change it.
Hope you post those Hindi new buildings screenshots soon ;)

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Re: Galian's weekly Update Post

Post by felinoel » Fri Oct 21, 2016 10:19 pm

png building files IS a bit of a resource hog...

Nice though that I suggested intercultural trading about half a decade ago and it is going to be implemented by chance lol

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Re: Galian's weekly Update Post

Post by MoonCutter2B » Sat Oct 22, 2016 5:20 am

"Hardcoded" :shock: ?
I.e. meaning:
- no more "Library" contents?
- no chance for other to contribute with contents?
- no customer controlled villages?
if so a very very sad face :( here.
I really hope the hardcoded version of the Norman buildings will be the one from the "Library" and not the original.
And I ask once again why not use the Schematica engine to build and upgrade the buildings?
It works nicely in MineColonies.

Ticlon
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Re: Galian's weekly Update Post

Post by Ticlon » Sat Oct 22, 2016 9:15 am

Great news! Even though custom buildings will be missed...

I do not know if this is the right place here, but regarding inter-cultural exchange and trade I remember a talk I had to Kinniken a few years ago. On the long-run it was planned to have the villages form new empires or kingdoms by trade and conquest, with villages of different cultures joining the same empire, and then exchange the goods (or 'adapt' to the strongest culture in their empire, using the same clothing for example). It would make sense to have a rivalry between at least military villages of the same culture, as they see themselves as the only true ancestors of their respective culture - and they expand conquering religious or other rather 'neutral' village types. But this is again nothing for the short-run, just wanted to throw it in before I forget it!

But, before everything goes hardcode, I still am highly for adding the new banners to villages and give them random colours to add more immersion and make villages of the same type more unique.
Back then I even kind of prepared the Byzantine armoury, the yellow and red decorations on the mace and armour are supposed to be dyed in the village colours (like the vanilla leather armour).

I am so happy that Millenaire finally gets a little bit more streamlined and will be more stable, so keep up your good work and ideas Galian! :D

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Zoythrus
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Re: Galian's weekly Update Post

Post by Zoythrus » Sat Oct 22, 2016 4:17 pm

Ticlon wrote:Great news! Even though custom buildings will be missed...

I do not know if this is the right place here, but regarding inter-cultural exchange and trade I remember a talk I had to Kinniken a few years ago. On the long-run it was planned to have the villages form new empires or kingdoms by trade and conquest, with villages of different cultures joining the same empire, and then exchange the goods (or 'adapt' to the strongest culture in their empire, using the same clothing for example). It would make sense to have a rivalry between at least military villages of the same culture, as they see themselves as the only true ancestors of their respective culture - and they expand conquering religious or other rather 'neutral' village types. But this is again nothing for the short-run, just wanted to throw it in before I forget it!

But, before everything goes hardcode, I still am highly for adding the new banners to villages and give them random colours to add more immersion and make villages of the same type more unique.
Back then I even kind of prepared the Byzantine armoury, the yellow and red decorations on the mace and armour are supposed to be dyed in the village colours (like the vanilla leather armour).

I am so happy that Millenaire finally gets a little bit more streamlined and will be more stable, so keep up your good work and ideas Galian! :D
Custom buildings are only disappearing temporarily. They'll come back eventually, but as I said, right now speed and stability are key. Millenaire will lose some functionality for the first few updates, as playability is key. We just want to get a baseline that we can add to, even if it inconveniences everyone for a few months.

And concerning empires, Galian has a few ideas regarding that, but I'll keep them a secret for now. :P

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Re: Galian's weekly Update Post

Post by felinoel » Sat Oct 22, 2016 5:34 pm

Ticlon wrote:Great news! Even though custom buildings will be missed...

I do not know if this is the right place here, but regarding inter-cultural exchange and trade I remember a talk I had to Kinniken a few years ago. On the long-run it was planned to have the villages form new empires or kingdoms by trade and conquest, with villages of different cultures joining the same empire, and then exchange the goods (or 'adapt' to the strongest culture in their empire, using the same clothing for example). It would make sense to have a rivalry between at least military villages of the same culture, as they see themselves as the only true ancestors of their respective culture - and they expand conquering religious or other rather 'neutral' village types. But this is again nothing for the short-run, just wanted to throw it in before I forget it!

But, before everything goes hardcode, I still am highly for adding the new banners to villages and give them random colours to add more immersion and make villages of the same type more unique.
Back then I even kind of prepared the Byzantine armoury, the yellow and red decorations on the mace and armour are supposed to be dyed in the village colours (like the vanilla leather armour).

I am so happy that Millenaire finally gets a little bit more streamlined and will be more stable, so keep up your good work and ideas Galian! :D
Woah you and I had the same conversation with Kinn a few years ago apparently lol

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Zoythrus
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Re: Galian's weekly Update Post

Post by Zoythrus » Sun Oct 23, 2016 12:12 am

Galian's ideas for "culture meshing" aren't exactly that idea, but I think it's just as good. "Trade Goods" are designed to also allow players to become merchants themselves, and allow sort of a shorthand for who's trading with whom.

Note, Galian's idea implies that people's clothes/ornaments only change if physical items are being passed around through trade, instead of "magical change." A Byzantine village must make the silk clothes before any Normans are wearing it. :)

I personally can't wait for this! It sounds like so much fun!

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Re: Galian's weekly Update Post

Post by ProsperCraft » Sun Oct 23, 2016 10:01 pm

Zoythrus wrote: A ton of the AI pathfinding has been reworked, and it's going to be a mesh of the original pathfinding and what 1.8 provides.
The mod community is stabilizing around 1.10.2 is 1.8 really the target?

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Re: Galian's weekly Update Post

Post by MoonCutter2B » Mon Oct 24, 2016 2:37 pm

1.8 is the BIG step. Getting from 1.8 to 1.10.2 is much smaller steps.
Gillian has done this trip with another mod before so I think we can trust that he knows what he is doing.
Might even be that he can have up-to-date versions for all three in the future (not sur ewhat he thinks about that though).

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Re: Galian's weekly Update Post

Post by felinoel » Tue Oct 25, 2016 2:38 pm

Zoythrus wrote:Galian's ideas for "culture meshing" aren't exactly that idea, but I think it's just as good. "Trade Goods" are designed to also allow players to become merchants themselves, and allow sort of a shorthand for who's trading with whom.

Note, Galian's idea implies that people's clothes/ornaments only change if physical items are being passed around through trade, instead of "magical change." A Byzantine village must make the silk clothes before any Normans are wearing it. :)

I personally can't wait for this! It sounds like so much fun!
I don't know I liked the merchants the Normans have, can't that get expanded too?

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Re: Galian's weekly Update Post

Post by Zoythrus » Tue Oct 25, 2016 6:39 pm

felinoel wrote:
Zoythrus wrote:Galian's ideas for "culture meshing" aren't exactly that idea, but I think it's just as good. "Trade Goods" are designed to also allow players to become merchants themselves, and allow sort of a shorthand for who's trading with whom.

Note, Galian's idea implies that people's clothes/ornaments only change if physical items are being passed around through trade, instead of "magical change." A Byzantine village must make the silk clothes before any Normans are wearing it. :)

I personally can't wait for this! It sounds like so much fun!
I don't know I liked the merchants the Normans have, can't that get expanded too?
So, here's how it was explained to me,
There are going to eventually (as in, maybe not first release) be three types of merchants:

Local Merchants
Stall Merchants
Foreign merchants

Local merchants are the ones who get spawned at an Inn and work the rounds between a few villages. Galian says that he wants to give each one a "shopping list" based off of the village they came from, so while they will still grab random resources from others, they'll attempt to find specific things. They'll also have a list of things to not grab. Mayan villages have no use for cross timber frames, so their merchants won't grab any. Local merchants allow villages to trade resources in an attempt to fill each others needs naturally.

Stall merchants are the ones that spawn in the Market and sell to the player. After discussion, we agreed to have their goods slowly leave their inventory if the village needs it, to imply that the village is also buying from them. That way, villages that need a particular resource, like a building material or food, can still get it from a merchant, but also leave enough for the players. They work as a way to provide resources to a village or player that might not be available, due to poor surrounding terrain or lack of other villages.

Lastly, there are foreign merchants, which I think also spawn at a market. They're guys like the Viking trader that the Normans get (which will spawn in all markets), they sell a ton of unique, exotic goods as well as things that you would have extreme difficulty finding, like diamond armor. In addition to that, they're going to be coded to buy large swaths of goods that a village has in abundance, so that the chests don't fill with 300 stacks of wood planks (*looks at Mayans*). This way, villages can continue to grow and progress without the fear of being hindered by an abundance of a resource, as foreign merchants are going to make sure that doesn't happen.

With all of these, villages should get into a rhythm that allows them to grow, even without you needing to continually babysit them. Keep relations good between them and you'll be rewarded....or you could just incite raids and get resources that way.

Samsonyt
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Re: Galian's weekly Update Post

Post by Samsonyt » Tue Oct 25, 2016 10:41 pm

Fantastic!

It is very unfortunate the custom buildings are disappearing for now, that was a big part of the game when Kin left off with it. Though it may be for the best. I remember Millenaire as not being well set up to handle multiplayer in custom/player owned villages.

It's good to hear admin commands are being added into millenaire in addition to the dev mode the game has built in already. I would love to see the mod continue to make advancements toward the quality of multiplayer in this way.

This is all very interesting and exciting news. One thing I wanted to add about Zoythrus' last post with regards to the foreign trader is that if the trader is going to buy out large quantities of goods to keep the village resources in check, it might be best to ensure they only do so once the goods have surpassed a certain limit which is set above the materials necessary to build each building. Some castle upgrades do require a ridiculously high amount of resources as I'm sure you guys remember and i'm sure Galian would be aware of this. I just wanted to mention it anyway.

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Re: Galian's weekly Update Post

Post by Zoythrus » Wed Oct 26, 2016 8:59 pm

Samsonyt wrote:Fantastic!

It is very unfortunate the custom buildings are disappearing for now, that was a big part of the game when Kin left off with it. Though it may be for the best. I remember Millenaire as not being well set up to handle multiplayer in custom/player owned villages.
They will return shortly, but we need to eliminate them for the time being for the sake of stability.
This is all very interesting and exciting news. One thing I wanted to add about Zoythrus' last post with regards to the foreign trader is that if the trader is going to buy out large quantities of goods to keep the village resources in check, it might be best to ensure they only do so once the goods have surpassed a certain limit which is set above the materials necessary to build each building. Some castle upgrades do require a ridiculously high amount of resources as I'm sure you guys remember and i'm sure Galian would be aware of this. I just wanted to mention it anyway.
We'll be working on ratios and things of that nature so that Foreign Traders don't just take all of the Mayans' cobblestone, which was probably hours of your work. We'll probably set them to grab things that either aren't needed or are far above what is needed.

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